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KrombopulosMichael

dragonscale weave for shirts?

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Tips for calculating how many rings I would need for a shirt?

I ordered one bag each of 16g 7/32" and 3/8" copper, that's 3.6 and 6.3 AR which should work well according to http://cmb.lotos.ca/weaves.html

I figure I can calculate that by dividing the square inches that my two bags make from the total square inches needed for the whole shirt (that I calculated using trl's shirt size calculator http://theringlord.com/cart/shopcontent.asp?type=Euro4in1ShirtCalculator that tells me the square feet i would need for my measurements)

I'm working on my stainless steel shirt right now. I have 36,000 rings 16g 7/32" AR 3.6. Right now I have over 8000 opened up, I'm going to open 18k and close 18k then I can just weave weave weave! Should take a few months, huh? And the dragonscale would take lolwut years?

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I don't think I'm going to be taking this project on, especially with rings this small. It's a very rigid sheet.

@Rob MacLennan Very slow going = fiddley? lol

@Konstantin the Red I want heavy! I think I will take the advice in another thread of wearing 2 shirts instead of trying denser weaves.

@losthelm I can only imagine. I'm not looking forward to that part of the shirt I'm making out of regular ol' 4-1... I am, but I'm not. If that makes sense...

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I wonder what you want the big-heavy for.

I am used to scheming out the overall weight budget for complete harness of all descriptions:  so much for both legs, both arms, how much for torso and neck, type and weight of helm.  All this before you bend over and pick up your shield and weapon!  See, you want a balance between effective protection against getting bones broken and a capacity to run across a field of battle.

And I've seen a good many SCA people do without mail altogether, on weight control grounds.

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Well... okay.  Are you in your mid-teens or late teens?  You want to begin weight-resistance training after you've gotten most of your growth.

But I'd go with barbells and seeing about access to a Nautilus machine for strength gain before using mail hauberks or other shirts.  Both free weights and machines put the exertion all through the developing muscle's complete range of motion from full extension to fullest contraction.  Strength follows.  As does size.  A shirt may have marginal effect on core-musculature exercises like decline-bench situps; no effect at all on leg lifts.

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I'm 32 and 5/6th, been lifting heavy ass weights for 5+ years 

Some youtubes on the subject that inspired me, although I always wanted to wear a weighted vest or soemthing

 

 

Edited by KrombopulosMichael
Adding youtube videos for lulz

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I'd be more worried about the weight of the shirt for another reason - even at 16g, with that much weight, how well will the copper hold up before the weight of the shirt starts to put a strain on your closures? Dense, complex weaves look awesome, but the heavier the shirt, the more strain it puts on the integrity of the shirt.

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Make a 4 in 1 out of 12 guage galvanized steel fence wire.  Mine weighs in the neighborhood of 40 pounds and it has no sleeves.  Yea, I was that guy at the ren-fair. :-)

In addition, you want to talk about cut forearms and biceps.  Cutting and opening/closing 12 gauge rings is a workout. 

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Want a murderously heavy shirt that will prove your power level is over 9000?  Make a full length, full sleeve, 16g 1/4" ID spring temper stainless haubergon and weld every ring shut.  Should weigh between 40-50 lbs and your forearms will bulge like you lead a 5.10 climbing route with no rope.  I think copper would pull itself apart at your given sizes and weights.  I've tried wearing my maille shirts around and it does get you accustomed to wearing them, and moving better in them, but man do my shoulders, neck, lower back, and knees hate it.  

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I know I'm a little late to the party, but actually , according to my website's weave chart, that combination of ars in the same wide diameter would NOT work well in applications requiring flexibility.  3.6 is the minimum ar for the smaller ring which makes a stiff sheet. The "general ar "  column is more suited to most maillers ' needs.

Edited by Chainmailbasket_com

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On 4/27/2017 at 2:16 AM, Fenris said:

Want a murderously heavy shirt that will prove your power level is over 9000?  Make a full length, full sleeve, 16g 1/4" ID spring temper stainless haubergon and weld every ring shut.  Should weigh between 40-50 lbs and your forearms will bulge like you lead a 5.10 climbing route with no rope.  I think copper would pull itself apart at your given sizes and weights.  I've tried wearing my maille shirts around and it does get you accustomed to wearing them, and moving better in them, but man do my shoulders, neck, lower back, and knees hate it.  

spring temper is heavier as well as harder? welding the rings makes them heavier too?

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^Neither, Michael.  As you're probably thinking.  But strong? -- oh yes, you betcha.

Yet, the strong is strong against the incursions of edge and point -- within reason; you want guaranteed kill on a man in hi-performance mail, you use a pickaxe.  You want almost-guaranteed, whack him with the axe edge of a halberd before you position yourself to run him through with a low bayonet-thrust of its point.

What springy wire gives you is higher strength at lighter weight if you'd like it, and most do.  They knew about this, at least in the Renaissance, where it seems they recognized two qualities of chainmail:  the regular stuff of plain unhardened wire and the hard, high-tensile mail of higher carbon wire -- I figure around 0.40-0.50% C in the batch, and heat treatable -- which cost appreciably more.  On Divers Arts describes case hardening to bring the cheap stuff to the performance of the expensive mail, by cementation w/heat treat.  Highly effective, through a wire cross section of 1mm, with an afternoon's baking at red heat.  Worth while, I suppose, if you already have a pretty good stash of the cheaper mail in hand -- how would you brightly say, "Hey! Let's do a batch upgrade!" in Renaissance Italian?:stuart:  Otherwise your hardworking Ringharnischer (a German immigrant no doubt) has to lay in a supply of music wire to work up into mail.

Edited by Konstantin the Red

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